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Drck

AR15 Muzzle Devices

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Just ordered a Precision Armament AFAB for a 14.5 Colt upper and a SLR Rifleworks Synergy Comp 5.56 for my LMT.  I have a carbine course coming up in early May and I'm looking forward to seeing how these perform.  I believe the AFAB is a popular one and highly recommended from a friend and MIL/LE firearms trainer.  I found the SLR comp after I ordered one of their rails.

For years, I had A2s on all my ARs except for one that has a BattleComp.  Now that I've been shooting more, both competition and some training, I've found comps help my split times as well as on multiple target transitions. 

What muzzle devices are you folks using? 

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I’ve got a Battlecomp 2.0 on my sbr, but only because I like fireballs and hate people. I’m gonna have to swap that once I’m back in a free state. 

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Mostly leave a clone xm 177 flash hider on the end of the barrel when i havent got a can attached. 

Mainly cause i dont really need tools to tighten it on or off and it acts as a good thread protector.

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M4sd from Griffin Armament it's like a battlecomp with a 3 prong on the end. Not much side blast from what my friends have told me and it shoots flat and awesome

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36 minutes ago, Etho said:

Anything but a comp. Hate the damn things. Mostly Phantoms. 

You'd be ok with a brake?

For reference, I'm referring to comps that mitigate muzzle rise and brakes that mitigate recoil impulse or rearward pressure.

Just mentioning that so we're all talking apples and apples.  (not that you didn't know that E)

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3 minutes ago, Danatkins said:

M4sd from Griffin Armament it's like a battlecomp with a 3 prong on the end. Not much side blast from what my friends have told me and it shoots flat and awesome

These two that I ordered have a small section of prong end that are meant to help with flash signature.  Not really a significant concern for me, but just mentioning.

There's the VG6 brakes that they have a CAGE (forget what the acronym is for) device that mitigates the side blast, both sound and pressure wave. 

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3 minutes ago, Drck said:

You'd be ok with a brake?

For reference, I'm referring to comps that mitigate muzzle rise and brakes that mitigate recoil impulse or rearward pressure.

Just mentioning that so we're all talking apples and apples.  (not that you didn't know that E)

Comps and brakes don’t belong on a low recoil gas gun in my opinion. Not in the way I use ARs anyway. They’re terrible inside of shoot houses with brakes/comps. Even with ear pro your sinuses are pulsing and head pounding. Even worse when on a short barrel. 

Open air competition only guns, sure why not. I tried them on my .308 and they messed with accuracy so bad it wasn’t worth it. Not even going to bother on my Creedmoor. 

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1 hour ago, Etho said:

Comps and brakes don’t belong on a low recoil gas gun in my opinion. Not in the way I use ARs anyway. They’re terrible inside of shoot houses with brakes/comps. Even with ear pro your sinuses are pulsing and head pounding. Even worse when on a short barrel. 

Open air competition only guns, sure why not. I tried them on my .308 and they messed with accuracy so bad it wasn’t worth it. Not even going to bother on my Creedmoor. 

I've come across many that feel that way actually.  I generally feel that they aren't needed, but do see the benefit in many aspects.  But yeah, noise and pressure wave not of those.

Hell, there are many brakes that I hate being next to in open air.  Like the Miculek and Titan.  Those fucker are down right OBNOXIOUS! 

I wouldn't put a comp or brake on my .308.  Maybe if I had something that kicked more like a .338 Lapua or bigger. 

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I haven't shot indoors with the BC much.  However, one of courses that I have taken recently are former SSD (Honolulu PD's SWAT).  They are awesome instructors, Sig Sauer master instructors, yadda, yadda, yadda.  Anyways, we were talking about comps and brakes being loud.  They kind of laughed at some stories of first time they used flash bangs in training and how loud those things were.  If we took their courses that involved shoothouses, they said they would let us try.  Uhh, I kinda of want to and kinda don't.  Haha. 

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Found out shooting tannerite at dusk when using a comp turns out to just be a waste of money, as the fireball and concussion from the muzzle blast seem to out perform the actual tannerite. Those fuckers are seriously loud. xD

10 minutes ago, Drck said:

I haven't shot indoors with the BC much.  However, one of courses that I have taken recently are former SSD (Honolulu PD's SWAT).  They are awesome instructors, Sig Sauer master instructors, yadda, yadda, yadda.  Anyways, we were talking about comps and brakes being loud.  They kind of laughed at some stories of first time they used flash bangs in training and how loud those things were.  If we took their courses that involved shoothouses, they said they would let us try.  Uhh, I kinda of want to and kinda don't.  Haha. 

Oh no. If you have the opportunity to get flash banged, you are required to do so, and post video here.

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44 minutes ago, JRed said:

 

Oh no. If you have the opportunity to get flash banged, you are required to do so, and post video here.

I wouldn't be the one getting flash bangs thrown at. . . or maybe that's why they were laughing. . . :beeler:

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Flash bangs hurt. Bad. Not really a whole lot else to add to that.

If someone feels it so necessary and useful to have one, by all means. They aren’t coming near me with the goddamn thing. It’s also all fun and games until you’re doing some actual movements with two or more people. Try being the low of a High/Low position and having some numbnut with a comp above you. Advancing together or even staggered. Fuck all that. 

We banish people with comps and brakes to the end of the range when we teach anything to do with rifles. We also pair them together. Let them punish each other. Obnoxious and pointless. 

Edited by Etho

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It’s been so long since I’ve shot at a range without walls between the shooters , I’ve forgotten what sitting next to a person with a comp on is like. I like my comp/brake on my rpr but I don’t use it at a range or indoors and seldom have another person with me. 

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9 hours ago, Etho said:

Flash bangs hurt. Bad. Not really a whole lot else to add to that.

If someone feels it so necessary and useful to have one, by all means. They aren’t coming near me with the goddamn thing. It’s also all fun and games until you’re doing some actual movements with two or more people. Try being the low of a High/Low position and having some numbnut with a comp above you. Advancing together or even staggered. Fuck all that. 

We banish people with comps and brakes to the end of the range when we teach anything to do with rifles. We also pair them together. Let them punish each other. Obnoxious and pointless. 

Did that with a buddy of mine one time he had a big nasty looking brake on his barrel and I could've shoved it up his ass. My least favorite that I've been around is a regular 74 style brake. Had a 2 port one from Griffin on my old spr and made the mistake of firing it during testing just pointed it out of dad's garage and fired into the ditch. I was waiting for my ears to bleed

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14 hours ago, Etho said:

Flash bangs hurt. Bad. Not really a whole lot else to add to that.

If someone feels it so necessary and useful to have one, by all means. They aren’t coming near me with the goddamn thing. It’s also all fun and games until you’re doing some actual movements with two or more people. Try being the low of a High/Low position and having some numbnut with a comp above you. Advancing together or even staggered. Fuck all that. 

We banish people with comps and brakes to the end of the range when we teach anything to do with rifles. We also pair them together. Let them punish each other. Obnoxious and pointless. 

I hear ya.  I generally don't like shooting next to folks with the more obnoxious ones.  The BC isn't much more than an A2. 

12 hours ago, vic_b said:

It’s been so long since I’ve shot at a range without walls between the shooters , I’ve forgotten what sitting next to a person with a comp on is like. I like my comp/brake on my rpr but I don’t use it at a range or indoors and seldom have another person with me. 

Were the walls padded?

5 hours ago, Danatkins said:

Did that with a buddy of mine one time he had a big nasty looking brake on his barrel and I could've shoved it up his ass. My least favorite that I've been around is a regular 74 style brake. Had a 2 port one from Griffin on my old spr and made the mistake of firing it during testing just pointed it out of dad's garage and fired into the ditch. I was waiting for my ears to bleed

I haven't shot my AR with the BC without ear pro.  I've been maybe 30 yards from folks using them and without ear pro.  That was pretty loud.  I was at the rifle range one morning and the SSD/SWAT snipers were shooting before the range opened.  They all had suppressors.  Then a guy came late and his rifle had a comp.  That thing woke us up as no one had ear pro.  O.o

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On 4/12/2018 at 12:42 PM, Drck said:

I hear ya.  I generally don't like shooting next to folks with the more obnoxious ones.  The BC isn't much more than an A2. 

Were the walls padded?

I haven't shot my AR with the BC without ear pro.  I've been maybe 30 yards from folks using them and without ear pro.  That was pretty loud.  I was at the rifle range one morning and the SSD/SWAT snipers were shooting before the range opened.  They all had suppressors.  Then a guy came late and his rifle had a comp.  That thing woke us up as no one had ear pro.  O.o

My hearing is so fucked I can be as close as 10 yards to a rifle and it doesn't even phase my hearing. I can shoot one without earpro and it muffles slightly. Last physical for work my hearing was the equivalent of someone in their mid 50s. I haven't gone without earpro ever except work stuff and duck hunting. But years of be within in feet of a 12 gauge firing 3" and 3.5" mags probably did it in. 

Needless to say in the next 5-10 I'll be shopping for hearing aids. 

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47 minutes ago, Etho said:

My hearing is so fucked I can be as close as 10 yards to a rifle and it doesn't even phase my hearing. I can shoot one without earpro and it muffles slightly. Last physical for work my hearing was the equivalent of someone in their mid 50s. I haven't gone without earpro ever except work stuff and duck hunting. But years of be within in feet of a 12 gauge firing 3" and 3.5" mags probably did it in. 

Needless to say in the next 5-10 I'll be shopping for hearing aids. 

What? Just about completely deaf on the left side and the wife says I'm losing on the right too. The left is nerve damage so an aid will do no good.

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3 hours ago, Etho said:

My hearing is so fucked I can be as close as 10 yards to a rifle and it doesn't even phase my hearing. I can shoot one without earpro and it muffles slightly. Last physical for work my hearing was the equivalent of someone in their mid 50s. I haven't gone without earpro ever except work stuff and duck hunting. But years of be within in feet of a 12 gauge firing 3" and 3.5" mags probably did it in. 

Needless to say in the next 5-10 I'll be shopping for hearing aids. 

That sucks. Any tinnitus? 

A Marine friend of mine is maybe 26-27 and has tinnitus. Years of shooting without ear pro. He was a scout sniper, so they shot quite a bit. Wasn’t a desk POG. 

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1 minute ago, Drck said:

That sucks. Any tinnitus? 

A Marine friend of mine is maybe 26-27 and has tinnitus. Years of shooting without ear pro. He was a scout sniper, so they shot quite a bit. Wasn’t a desk POG. 

Yeah. If I don’t have white noise sometimes it’ll drive me bonkers. It comes and goes on strength. But it’s always there.

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26 minutes ago, Etho said:

Yeah. If I don’t have white noise sometimes it’ll drive me bonkers. It comes and goes on strength. But it’s always there.

He’s similar. Has to have TV or music on to sleep. Otherwise all he hears is like a high pitched “Eeeeeeeee”. 

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2 hours ago, vic_b said:

What? Just about completely deaf on the left side and the wife says I'm losing on the right too. The left is nerve damage so an aid will do no good.

From work? Or shooting?

I have to take hearing conservation training every year. Lots of shipyard guys lose hearing from the shop noise. 

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4 hours ago, Drck said:

From work? Or shooting?

I have to take hearing conservation training every year. Lots of shipyard guys lose hearing from the shop noise. 

Not really sure. I had an ear infection while I was in the navy and after reading about Huey Lewis and his Meniere disease I had/have the same symptoms. So I’m just wondering if that’s what it was. I have tinnitus in that ear too. A little white noise or a tv going helps me sleep. But it’s a constant presence. Sometimes real faint others so loud I wonder if others can hear it. 

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Forgot to report back on the muzzle devices after a carbine class. 

Gun #1 - Colt 14.5" carbine upper with pinned and welded Precision Armament AFAB.  This was my primary gun and shot it for the first day and a half, which was about 300 rounds.  Overall, very happy with the gun and performance of the comp.  Other shooters reported it wasn't much louder than an A2 and one of those was a first time carbine shooter who was shooting to my left. Well, maybe the Arsenal AK with brake to me right made mine seem mellow.  Anyways, was able to do multiple shot and multiple transition drills with the gun and I think it did help keep the dot from dancing around.  My previous gun is a much heavier upper with A2 and that helped reduce the muzzle jumping around (exaggerated of course as the dot didn't move that much), but this Colt is a LOT lighter and I noticed the effect on muzzle movement.  I noticed when we were doing one hole drills and how little the muzzle moved.  After one particularly intense course of fire and I noticed the handguard heating up, I noticed that the comp had some wiggle.  >:( Not sure what happened, but believe the person who installed didn't torque it down properly before pinning and welding.  This comp uses shims instead of crush washers, but still.  The gun is back with the guy for a redo.  He is working with me and split the cost of the new comp, so am giving him a chance to make things right.

Gun #2 - LMT MRP rifle length upper, 16" midlength gas barrel with SLR Rifleworks Synergy Comp.  I brought this upper as my backup gun and I was lucky that I did.  This was my former primary class gun and I decided to try the SLR on this one.  Was using this gun when we started doing multiple target transitions and stuff like VTAC 1-5.  Tough to say the difference between the SLR and an A2, but I believe it helped reduce the muzzle climb.  What I did notice was when we started shooting from distance, it seemed to help with follow up shots.  However, I also noticed the occasional fireball that would rise vertically from the comp.  Not super bad, but enough that I noticed.  Overall, not sure if I will keep the SLR on the gun.  I'm actually looking to sell this upper as I have other guns that I will shoot before this one.  While I like the upper since it seems to be quite accurate and the barrel swapping capability seems useful, it's just so darn heavy.  So I'm thinking I'm either going to sell it or turn it into a more precision gun and put a scope on it. 

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Was able to shoot both of my guns with the AFAB and the SLR Synergy Comp.  Probably around 300 rounds through each. 

AFAB - Love that device. It wasn't obnoxious at all.  I asked the shooters either side of me and they said it wasn't noticeably louder than an A2.  The shooter on the left of me was pretty new to shooting an AR, and it didn't bother her at all.  Though I think much of that was due to her pretty intense focus on the shooting, which I thought was great!  The upper that the AFAB was on is probably my lightest and the muzzle rise was minimal.  We did a number of cadence and multiple target exercises and didn't notice the dot jumping around much.  I wish I had the exact same upper set up with a pure flash hider to have done some side-by-side.  The only negative was that the device had worked loose after about 300 rounds, so back to the shop it goes.  Not sure what happened, but the shim was able to spin freely and the device itself seemed to be timed about right, even though it would twist slightly back and forth.

SLR - Switched to that upper after I noticed the AFAB had worked loose.  To me, it's louder than the AFAB.  We were doing multiple target exercises at that point and it seemed to help with keeping the dot from dancing around too much.  However, this is probably the heaviest upper that I have and I feel that that weight helps with the muzzle rise, so tougher to gauge.  But overall, I did feel that it helped with muzzle control.  One thing I did notice is every so often, I would see a red flash rise from the device.  Sort of like a quick red flame coming straight up.  Not super distracting, but something that I noticed here and there.  Not sure if I will stick with this one.  Might see it offered up in the classified section in a local forum.  I have one for my AK47, so will see. 

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Shot a carbine "skill builder" yesterday.  I was also able to test out a friend's gun for the Geissele trigger.  In that process, it was also a side-by-side comparison of the AFAB against the BCM comp, which is pretty close to an A2.  The muzzle jumped a LOT more when I was shooting the gun with the BCM comp and made me realize how effective the AFAB is at reducing the muzzle movement.  Knowing that, I will likely spend more time with my ARs that still have the A2 so I can be sure to practice muzzle control with body mechanics. 

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